Fezcast - The Saracens Supporters Podcast
The Fezcast is the best (only) Saracens fans podcast! Every week we bring you news, reviews, and interviews from around the Saracens Family, covering the men's and women's rugby teams, the Saracens Foundation and our partner clubs. The Fezcast is brought to you by Saracens fans, for Saracens fans - get in touch with us via Twitter, Instagram, YouTube or text the show via the show description in Apple Podcasts and Spotify. [Disclaimer: The Fezcast is brought to you in association with the Saracens Supporters Association and is not an official product of Saracens Ltd. Views are our own.]
Fezcast - The Saracens Supporters Podcast
S3 E39D: Saturday Knight Theo (with Toby Knight & Theo Dan)
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The final is coming up quickly and the excitement is building! For us fans at least!
Feet are firmly on the ground in the Saracen's squad as Jez finds out when he talks to two of the club's rising stars, back rower Toby Knight and hooker Theo Dan about learning from wise older heads, focussing on themselves and ignoring outside factors.
Jez also has a message for the players from the fans ahead of the big game.
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[Disclaimer: The Fezcast is brought to you on behalf of the Saracens Supporters Association and is not an official product of Saracens Ltd]
Title Music (from Season 4): "Herald" by This Winter Machine
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SPEAKER_01Um the Club have put up. Two of the young, bright stars of the future, but very much also in the present now. Welcome to the Fez Cast, Fio Dan and Toby Knight. How are you doing, gents?
SPEAKER_04All good. Thanks for having us. Yeah, good. Like you said, thank you for having us.
SPEAKER_01Oh, absolutely. It's great to hear from you guys. I mean, first things first, we'll say congratulations, both you personally and as a team and a squad on a season so far, bearing in mind that you know there's still the biggest job to do on the weekends. First question I ask: how's training been? We're recording this on the Tuesday. You just finished Tuesday training. Uh, we spoke to Kelly Brown last week, and then Kelly's interview went live um this morning, and he was talking about how last week was very much just a bit of recuperation, gently building in. I assume the intensity is now upping quite uh considerably in training.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, uh today we just had our, as you said, we had a high intensity day. So uh yeah, we're pretty pretty tired at the moment, but um, no, the intensity's been real high this week. As you said, last week was um was a brilliant week of preparation for us. Um, really sort of nailing down what we're trying to get after this weekend. Um, and yeah, today was uh today was a brilliant session. I think all the boys were looking really sharp and uh yeah, got the right intensity for the weekend.
SPEAKER_01Well, absolutely, and we're not gonna ask you to preempt any um selection uh um uh possibilities or anything like that. But I mean, uh, we're assuming that everybody's fit, raring to go. We know there's maybe a couple of players, Kelly let on there, might be a couple of players coming into the reckoning who've been out for a while, but everybody's looking good, feeling fit, no injuries in camp so far.
SPEAKER_05No, all good. Um, like you said, um quite lucky that Saris we've got good strength and depth, um, and everyone's been developed at the same time. So um, yeah, there might be a few faces coming back, but um, yeah, the squad's in a good place.
SPEAKER_01Well, the the next question I was going to ask you. I mean, you you two guys, uh, you know, you're right at the start of your careers. Theo, perhaps you're a little bit ahead of Toby and you know, in age and experience and everything. But you know, the club's this is what the rate final is it in the last 12-13 years, and there's players that have been around Goody, Faz, um, Jamie George have been around the club and have seen it, done it. How are the old heads? What we've come to start called in the dad's army um section at Sarsons, and you can use that if you want a bit of butt a bit later on, but yeah, how are the old boys um helping you youngsters, as it were, get ready for this, which is you know the biggest day of the year on domestic rugby?
SPEAKER_04Oh, yeah, I mean, as you alluded to before, I mean, there's those guys have been through I don't know how many finals they've been in, so obviously the experiences they have um is invaluable, and uh, I guess as a team now, um looking back on like sort of the past finals of the like the 2014, 15, 16, that's all Vera, it's quite a different team to now. Um, I thought the experience that we had last year in um having lost the final has been uh it was in a weird way. I feel like it was a good experience for the whole team because it was quite new. Um, and it's really given us something to sort of go after to make sure that you know we put things uh put things right this weekend.
SPEAKER_01Well, yeah, it's interesting you say that because there's a lot of correlations going back to when Saracens first won the premiership. So what when we were first we had 2010, 2011, the year before, a very narrow defeat, very much similar to last year's defeat by the same people, Leicester Tigers. I mean, I remember sitting there next to my niece at the time was about 10 years old and watching her crumple next to me and having to say, oh, it's only a game, it's all next year when I wasn't, you know. But you know, players like Jamie George who were around the club at that time, you experienced that. How have they used that, Toby, to just to tell you guys about what to expect this week and and how to use that as a positive energy going into this game?
SPEAKER_05Well, that for us, like young players, like you said, um, they just take the pressure off of us. So with them steering the ship, guiding us, um, they just take the pressure of us, telling us not to worry about making mistakes and just being all in and every play. Um, obviously, there's some detailed stuff that uh the whole squad is going after. We're all we're very on it with our smaller details, but yeah, we're very um, very much so a not worrying about uh making mistakes and yeah, just going out there and giving everything to every single play.
SPEAKER_01Well, absolutely. Now, the other question I'm gonna ask you guys as well, and and I don't want you to delve into the into the realms of you know the the banter or whatever it is, but I mean we've seen this week Shell Sharks have come out and they're making a big thing about the neutrals going to be supporting them, and you know, there's a definitely an element of you know, it's almost like being the mill wall in the in football, isn't it? Nobody likes us, but we don't care. Uh have the words of Sales Sharks been pinned to the to the uh to the dressing room walls and said, you know, there's your team talk, they they think everybody in the world wants us to lose. Is that an extra extra driver for us, Fio?
SPEAKER_04Uh not particularly to be honest, um, not at all. Um we haven't spoken about any of that, none of that's been mentioned. Um I think for us it's just as has been the case sort of the whole year, like, yeah, Sale are a brilliant team, and you know, we've got to give them the respect and do our homework on them. But the focus has just been on us this week um and making sure that we're bringing the best version of ourselves and making sure that individually and collectively as a team that we're you know we're bringing the best out of each other. Um and if we do that, we know we'll be in a good place um come Saturday, and I think you know, all that sort of talk from the outside, we just don't repay any attention to it.
SPEAKER_01Well, yeah, that's fair enough, and that's a a very mature way of looking at it for you. And again, obviously that comes from everybody throughout the club learn that. Now, perhaps Toby, I'll start with you first and talk about yourself personally as a season. I mean, this has been a real breakthrough season for you, hasn't it? And breaking into the first team, coming off the back of under 20s rugby. We had the premiership couple at start of the season, which perhaps was a bit of a humbling experience. Is that fair to say?
SPEAKER_05I mean, yeah, but if you if you look at the team that we're putting out, like there's a lot of fresh faces, a lot of boys um coming into the squad, their first year of men's rugby. So it's great exposure for them. And as Saris, like, although we are uh always want to win, we're never too worried about how results go. We're always focused on the attitude within the squad and the fight that we that we put out on the day. So it it was never too much of a humbling experience, so to speak. But yeah, like you said, it's it's it's been a great season for me, and um, I'm just trying to take everything in my stride and not get ahead of myself too much. Um, and yeah, just taking in all that wisdom from those older boys um and hopefully just do my job as best I can when I go out and play.
SPEAKER_01Well, indeed, and I mean that that was um apparent in the immediate aftermath of the Bath game, where you know, on the scorecard, it looked like a bit of a you know, a bit of a tickle, as it were. But the performances that were put in by yourself and the likes of Nathan and Ollie in the back row with you and and the young guys who came on, uh it just shows that the conveyor belt of players who are prepared for the big games, who've got the right attitude, who've got the right application, it is wonderful. And you know, bearing in mind you as a back row player, Toby, Jackson Ray, he um signs off at the end of the year, you know, there's positions there open, you've all put yourself and your hands up. And I mean, how important is it that you you know you've put yourself in that shop window, as it were?
SPEAKER_05I mean, uh it's been great for me having Jackson there because I mean, he's basically kind of taken me under his wing. He's been showing me the ropes, he's got so much experience um at the club and how the club works as well. So it's been really helpful for me this season. Um, he just it's just that small those small conversations I have with him where he takes the pressure off of me. Um, and yeah, hopefully I can go on to be as good a player as Jackson.
SPEAKER_01And and hopefully as well, he's taking you on the wing. I say you you've born in Essex, weren't you? Um Tony.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, we're actually from uh the same area.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, uh so I I'm assuming you that you're followed West Ham in the football as well, then.
SPEAKER_05No, no, no. I'm an Arsenal fan.
SPEAKER_01Oh, this is not not good enough. I really shouldn't really need a word with Jackson about that, but not to worry, not to worry.
SPEAKER_05He hasn't been able to uh he hasn't been able to spout that poison to me.
SPEAKER_01Oh well, never mind. We'll we'll have to work on that. Theo, you where are your football loyalties on this one?
SPEAKER_04Just uh uh uh proud Liverpool sport. Oh he's just come up now on the spot. I've not heard that one before being spawned thick and thin.
SPEAKER_01Oh, yeah, well, fair d's. I mean, that's the way it is. But over to you, Theo, and just to say, I mean, your season, as I say, Toby's you've just broken, really broken through this season. You've been there or thereabouts for a couple of seasons, you played a fair amount of championship level or whatever, but this year you've really been garnering some really great headlines, some great headlight, yeah. Um what's the word that highlight reels have been being shown from you? Some excellent performances, some tries, etc. etc. To the extent that people are even talking about, you know, future England international, potentially. I mean, I saw a report was saying is Fiodana Bolter for the England World Cup squad. How uh do you one how good is it to get these boards? It's to hear that people are are spotting you and admiring what you're doing, but secondly, how do you keep your feet on the floor? Do you have someone like Jamie George gives you a slap around the back of the head and and and uh keeping you in control?
SPEAKER_04Or no, it's uh it's pretty easy to keep your your feet on the ground when you've got some of the older boys at the club startingly reminding you every day. So no, it's uh it's been good, obviously. The season's been great for me um in terms of being able to actually play um in the first team regularly. Um you know the experiences that I've had this year have been fantastic. It's kind of for me, the season has gone beyond what I'd expected at the start of the year. Um I never thought that I'd rack up quite a few this many Prem caps at the beginning of the season. Um so yeah, uh the re the rest of stuff is sort of like headline wise. I mean you know, I'm I'm well aware that you know that what may get me picked for sort of international stuff is just being able to do my job day in, day out here, getting better. Um so I'm not too worried about that, I'm not too focused on it because as you said, we've got every week is just a huge game for us, and this year, this week, sorry, this weekend is just uh yeah, it's massive for us. So uh we're not trying to get too far ahead of ourselves and just taking sort of each day as it comes, really.
SPEAKER_01But I suppose in your position as well, uh uh playing at hooker, that you know, within the club, there's a hell of a lot of competition. I mean, we we we are blessed with some cracking hookers. I mean, KP's uh international, Ethan Lewis has had international caps, Wolfie, you know, there or thereabouts, and of course you've got Jamie George. And it's actually interesting looking at you coming through in the position, very much like when Jamie came through and he was under studying Shout Brits, he's one of the greatest players to have played the game any position in the premiership. Um, you know, Jamie coming through, and you think, oh, Shout's gonna retire. Jamie's coming towards that end of his career, but the opportunities are are there, and you've taken them with both hands, obviously.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, I mean as you said, that's sort of the competition with the hookers. I think we've we're blessed because you know, as you said, you know, Wolfie, KP, Ethan Lewis, Jamie, you know, these the competition is so so high every week in training. Um, so you as you said, you've really got to sort of bring the best out of each other. Um, and we we push each other um every sort of every day in training. So I guess you know, for us the competition is so good, and I guess that's why the depth it shows the depth we have. Um and yeah, you know, Jamie's been brilliant with me this season, sort of telling me about his sort of experiences and sort of sharing some uh some wisdom that he's amassed over the years. But uh, but no, it's the same really with all the other hookers. We're all here to help each other out and ultimately do sort of what's best for the team.
SPEAKER_01I I take it that's the same in the back row. You've already mentioned Toby, um Jackson Ray being uh helping you, but you've got Ben Earl, Billy Venapoto, obviously, you know, who's been on the sidelines now. But I mean, how much experience does that guy have? And the other guys are around the club. Um, gonna ask you, I mean, growing up watching Saracens, who's one player, Toby, as a back row that if you do get onto the field, if you are selected this weekend, we're not preempting any selection here whatsoever, but if you go on the field, who's who's a player that you really admire from Saracen's files of the past? Because I know I know who who I think uh the the right person to think about is, but I'll be interested to see what you what your thoughts are.
SPEAKER_05I mean, it's a very tough question, that, because we've had some fabulous players over the years. Um God, I don't know if I if I could take a mixture of, I know it's a bit of a cop-out answer, but if if I could take a mixture of all of them, I would. Um ultimately for me, Jez, I'm just trying to be the best player that I can be, um, and really hone in on what my strengths are. Um, so yeah, I'm I'm just gonna try and put my best foot forward, like if the if the opportunity comes up in future games. Um but yeah, I I can't I can't really give you an answer there.
SPEAKER_01Well, that's fair enough. I mean, I the the the guy that has a back row and I think epitomized what it is to be in a final is the guy who tells you all and he'll tell you this weekend, no doubt on Twitter, that it's time to go to work, and that's Jack Berger. And and that's where I want to finish this from with a message from the fans to you guys, but also the players, the squad, the team, whoever's there, that you know, we do this Fez cast because we love Saracens, and and as much as they'll we'll go back through episodes and episodes of me telling you about how great a number eight I was, I wasn't that great a number eight. So you guys are living my dreams, as it were, and lots of our dreams. But when you go onto that pitch for however long, if you're starting a game, if you come on to the game, I want you guys to remember that it's not just 15 guys on the field or 23 guys on the on the in the squad. There's going to be a shed load of people wearing Saracen shirts who will make every tackle with you, who will make every hit for you, or hit every ruck. And I'm still making the tackles that Jack Berger made in in 2011 in my mind. Um, because we are 100% behind you. We think you are an amazing bunch of lads, a brilliant team to get behind, who epitomize everything that we think is important about sport. And we just want to wish you guys all the best. We're not gonna say the best of luck because we don't think we need you need it, because you are prepared, ready to go. You're humble, you've got the work rate, the teamwork, the discipline to do this, but just know that it's not just you guys on the pitch. There's gonna be 10,000, 15,000 of us in that Twickenham crowd all behind you making those hits, and please use that power on Saturday.
SPEAKER_04Thank you very much, mate. Appreciate it.
SPEAKER_01Thank you. Absolutely. Well, thank you guys for joining us. Thank you for the interview. It's been wonderful speaking to you, and as I say, all the best of the weekends, and we hope to see you lifting that cup and doing a proper tiki tonga uh with a few champagnes and beers after the after the game on Saturday.
SPEAKER_04Fingers crossed. Thank you very much, mate. Cheers.
SPEAKER_01Thanks a lot.
SPEAKER_03This is the Fezcast.